Joe Knox Oral History
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Joe Knox Oral History Transcript
Interview conducted by Bunny Corkill, Transcribed by Raeburn Sottile
Disclaimer: The views and opinions expressed in this interview are those of the interviewer and interviewee and do not necessarily reflect the views and opinions of Churchill County Museum or any of its employees.
Content Warning: Ableism including r-slur around 5:26. This is preserved to highlight its presence and normalization within Churchill County at this time.
Note: Obituaries say that Joseph C. Knox was born September 18, 1903 in Amelath, Michigan. His parents were John Wren Knox and Cora Edith White Knox. The family moved to Fallon in 1906. He had at least three sisters named Lucille, Thelma, and Cora Austin and a brother named Pearlie. He passed away March 17, 1994 in Sparks and was buried in Fallon Cemetery.
KNOX: Oh, that White came out and picked up the cream and everything.
CORKILL: Oh… [Loud bang, almost like a gunshot] Now, okay, M.B. Johnson made cigars-
KNOX: Right.
CORKILL: [long pause] In Fallon. And where in downtown was his…
KNOX: Under the Standard office [60 W. Center st.]
CORKILL: Oh, in the basement of the standard? Uh-huh.
KNOX: Nolan… probably Ham was in there.
CORKILL: He might have been in there too, because that Rally Ham, he didn’t live very long. He had a terrible- [tape cuts] Okay, so now M.B. Johnson made cigars in Fallon in the basement under the Standard.
KNOX: I could be wrong there.
CORKILL: And Rally Ham…
KNOX: Rally Hamm was in there.
CORKILL: Hamm…
KNOX: I believe M.B. Johnson was in a little cubbyhole there in in Sagebrush [Café, 70 S. Maine]
CORKILL: Oh, Okay.
KNOX: I believe.
CORKILL: Well, it probably doesn’t take too awful much room to make cigars.
KNOX: No. Every tremor he’d pack in [unintelligible] stuff it in his mouth [?]! [laughing]
CORKILL: Oh how funny!
KNOX: That was all… [ long pause] Forget the fellow’s name right now, but he was in there. In Stillwater.
CORKILL: So you had to deliver two boxes of Johnson cigars to the Stillwater…
KNOX: Every week.
CORKILL: [long pause] …water saloon every week. And so did you also, did you ever deliver baby chickens or anything like that?
KNOX: No.
CORKILL: Just the groceries?
KNOX: Groceries, mail, papers.
CORKILL: Well, that’s, um…
KNOX: Misses… [?]
CORKILL: See, I have a story that I did in my last quarterly of- out of the newspaper, about Mrs. Greenwood, her passing away,
KNOX: Uh-huh, uh-huh, uh-huh.
CORKILL: -And it told about the family. And then also there was a man named LeBeau that had a hot springs down there. Did you ever know Alfred LeBeau?
KNOX: Yeah, yeah.
CORKILL: Well see, his-
KNOX: I knew Alfred a little differently than you did. [Pause] Yeah, uh-huh.
CORKILL: Yeah, um, well you see out there, like in the four-mile flat going out towards Frenchman, they found some graves. They’ve known about them for many years, but it turned out that those were some of his sisters, because the family I guess had a little store out there, some kind of a station. So how many years did you run the mail now?
KNOX: Oh, I was just talking six months.
CORKILL: Oh, six months on the mail? Okay. And then what was your next venture?
KNOX: Well, down to dairy there, the Forsberg dairy.
CORKILL: Forsberg?
KNOX: For Forsberg, yeah.
CORKILL: And where was that? Out in the Sheckler district, or..?
KNOX: I don’t know the… didn't call it that.
CORKILL: Okay, have any wild memories of life in the dairy?
KNOX: [laughing] No, not a bit.
CORKILL: Not really? Okay, so from then, now it’s getting up to be about 1920, you think?
KNOX: I was 18.
CORKILL: In the 18s?
KNOX: 19, I started working on the draglines. I went to the ranch, Grimes Ranch, when I was 19.
CORKILL: Now when you say you worked on the draglines, it was for the TCID [Truckee-Carson Irrigation District]?
KNOX: No, it was for the government, then.
CORKILL: Oh, for the [Bureau of] Reclamation?
KNOX: Yeah.
CORKILL: Uh-huh.
KNOX: Before TCID.
CORKILL: Yeah, you’re right. Now, see, Percy and Lydia [Libby? Liddy?] tell about how the cookhouse and the things were down right on the place where they later homesteaded, that reclamation, and they tell about Mr. Frank Gibbs, that the people that worked there were kind of pranksters and one Halloween they put his buggy up on top of a post as a practical joke, and the next day when he came his buggy was up there. But they tell about the fact that it cost so much- the government had so much money in that ground the people could never get it back out. And what do you remember about that?
KNOX: Well, I don’t remember all that much about it. If I remember right, you know, people had to pay $8000 for it, now I’m not sure about that, you know, I just hear and it’s been a long time ago. Most of them were made to- by the time they’d have paid for, why they’d pulled out and left.
CORKILL: Yeah, one of… There was a Rice family, and they… Lydia always tells about how they were doing really pretty well, but then finally they lost their place too.
KNOX: Yep. They had two boys that was retarded. Great big husky boys.
CORKILL: See, Lydia tells me that they had a daughter named Elma. See, Percy and Lydia had a Felma, who’s now- I digress- and they had an Elma also, and she says that when Elma was quite small they went down to Mrs. Rice’s one day to visit. And they had these little nails, like you use for putting roofing on, and she said that little girl got in there, and she’s sure that she swallowed some of those little nails, and then later on when she was in high school, well she said from then on her stomach and things never worked right.
KNOX: Oh wow.
CORKILL: And finally when that girl was in high school she died. And she says she’s just sure that it was from those nails. So now, you say you’re 19 years old, and that would be 1921, you went to work at the Grimes ranch. Do you remember the teams that would go down like in front of the Cushman ranch and make a sharp turn on… Where would they go, about? Wasn’t that pasture road out by Wightman’s?
KNOX: Yes, uh-huh.
CORKILL: And then they’d make another right and go down through that in front of Grimes’ Ranch?
KNOX: Right.
CORKILL: Well, Percy says he remembers two of those. He says there’d be sixteen, you know, or twenty mules or horses, and he says he doesn’t know how those men ever got those animals around that corner because it was pretty sharp.
KNOX: Well, my sister and I were going in one time on… let's see… on Allen road.
CORKILL: What we call Harrigan now that was part of… the length then?
KNOX: Let’s see… I gotta be… come out by Safeway [Probably 461 W Williams Ave]
CORKILL: Oh Taylor!
KNOX: Taylor, yeah. They’d come up from Tedford’s, you know where his place was. They’d come up. My sister and I had a horse and cart and we pulled in here. It was a 20-horse team. Coming up… coming up it’d be Center Street, I think, and they started to make this turn. I was sitting there watching, you know, and they come around. One of the traces of the horses caught in my cart wheel and turned it over. [laughing]
CORKILL: Oh my! So you’re under the 20 mule team, huh?
KNOX: Yeah! [Laughing] My sister and I saw her on our hands and knees, running, you know as fast as she could. The cart, I’d be- Cartwheel to the ground. It hit me right in the back and I was pinned down. When I got up I didn’t know what happened to her, because Mae was painting her in [?]
CORKILL: Oh my gosh…
KNOX: The way they done that was… the leader’d go clear on by, way on by, then they started pointers out, sixes out, each of them jumped the chain, keep the wagon moving while these others doubled back.
CORKILL: Oh my gosh… Well see, I didn’t realize. I thought if they ever got over the chain there was a terrible wreck, but they got them over it on purpose!
KNOX: Jumped the chain, yeah.
CORKILL: On purpose.
KNOX: Yeah.
CORKILL: And so, then, that would be like going up Williams Avenue up to go out towards Reno?
KNOX: No, out towards Beckstead’s.
CORKILL: Oh, see, now that’s where I live. I live on Beckstead place.
KNOX: Oh?
CORKILL: Right… See, when Harry Corkill and Tom came here in 1930 about, they bought that Becksted place. And that’s where Bill and I and our kids have always lived, on that store, and you know we would give anything to have a picture of it, but nobody seems to have a picture of it. Do you know… do you remember going there and, like, where they might have had the outhouses or anything?
KNOX: Well, I wouldn’t [loud noise] I was there many times.
CORKILL: Like where you there when- was Vaughn [spelling?] still there? Did you know that Vaughn that started it? Because he died way in the- maybe 1960s?
KNOX: I knew of him, I never knew him…
CORKILL: Roger Vaughn.
KNOX: I don’t recall about… See, some teams went that way, and some went out right down the canal that passed up by our old place.
CORKILL: Oh yeah. What would be now Wildes road? And so- I mean… Oh…
KNOX: If you head out the canal…
CORKILL: Oh, on that Testolin?
KNOX: Going on… going…
CORKILL: East?
KNOX: East. See that was the Lincoln Highway
CORKILL: Well, you see, I always thought the Lincoln Highway came down what we now call Harrigan road, and it made the big dead man’s curve out there by Matthewson’s? You remember what they call the dead man’s curve?
KNOX: Yeah.
CORKILL: And then it went out east. And then it went right through past the Grimes… Well, you know, maybe it cut it in half maybe, but it was… now the Navy has a gate there and you can’t go through there anymore. But I always thought that was the Lincoln
KNOX: Well, they changed it.
CORKILL: Oh yeah?
KNOX: -Into Reno. It was right down the canal then they changed it over there and
CORKILL: So it would be what is now Testolin? That was at one time…? Okay. [Long pause] Now, was Mr. Grimes alive when you went to work there?
KNOX: No.
CORKILL: No?
KNOX: Not when I went to work, you know, he was awhile dead. [Died 1918] Mr. Grimes was alive when I was going to school.
CORKILL: And then- but he did other things, Mr. Grimes, when he did things in town like he was… a town official, or something, didn’t he? He did a lot of book work.
KNOX: Yeah, yeah.
CORKILL: Probably more than actual manual labor. [Long pause] So, now, you worked under Nichols? Or did you work there when Frank Cushman was…
KNOX: I went to work for… for Frank, Yeah. See, before Frank went there, Fred Wightman was the superintendent. He had Iola [?] Wightman and Earl Johnson, and I sat with all his foremen. Lish Sanford boarded the men… I remember… they began to cut down. Guess Lish was the only one there for a few years.
CORKILL: Did you know Snow Wightman? Fred’s wife? My Uncle Wayne’s mother? Well, I didn’t know it, but I have a tape recording of Ray Downs, you know, that lived down on Pasture Road, his daughter in Florida did it, and he got to telling about Snow, who was his sister. And he said that she was six feet tall and weighed at least 250lbs pounds and the reason that she died, she heard of this operation that they could cut the fat out of you, you know, just pieces of fat, so she went to San Francisco and had that operation and she died down there, but see I’d never heard that story before. And Fred Wightman, I always thought that he was kind of small, but was he large man you felt?
KNOX: Oh yeah. He was a big fat fella.
CORKILL: Was he? But he was tall too you think?
KNOX: Well, not too tall, no, but he was real-
CORKILL: And I have a story- I have a paper when he was in town and got a big cut. A fellow with a knife slit his throat for him, but he survived that.
KNOX: Yeah. Well, the fellow quit or Fred run him off or something. He walked to town. Fred said he'd bring his bed, you know when he come in he didn't have a bed, so he cut rough right in there [unintelligible]
CORKILL: Yeah that's what I heard. Now, before we go on with the Grimes Ranch, what became of your dad in the end? Did he just live here out the rest of his life or-
KNOX: No. No, he went down to California. I don't know what date, but… pretty early.
CORKILL: But he… his homestead didn't turn out to make him…
KNOX: No. No, no, he borrowed money on it, finally lost it. Fellow by the name of Thornton, I think Thornton sold it to John Brown.
CORKILL: Okay.
KNOX: My dad went down there and built… kinda built a…
CORKILL: Yeah, it doesn't matter, but he didn't stay around here. And did any of your other siblings, the other sisters, other than Cora, did they stay here?
KNOX: No, she went down there with Dad, Thelma, did. Lucille married Frank White. They followed the mining town around. Finally went to Nevada City and wound up in Sacramento.
CORKILL: Okay, well now when you went out there to the Grimes Ranch, it was mostly native grasses or did they try to raise-
KNOX: Oh, they had alfalfa. See, they had two big caterpillars working there and about 6, 8-horse teams leveling ground before when Frank went there [?]
CORKILL: Well now, do you remember anything about… when I was saying about what was called Redman's Station, and apparently it was where the two sloughs met, the one from Stillwater and the Carson slough, and in the early days, like in the 1860s or so, there was a bridge there and the emigrants had to come over the bridge, and apparently there was like a building, a store-type and Lydia says that she remembers one time going there and there was a book that perhaps told the names of the people that bought things, and then she said she thought that Bill Lee ended up with it. One of the Lees.
KNOX: Uh huh.
CORKILL: Did you ever remember seeing anything like that?
KNOX: No, but I know the bridge.
CORKILL: Uh-huh.
KNOX: Jimmy Woods' dad claimed that he gave a – it was a toll bridge – and he gave a knife and a ring of keys to get across there.
CORKILL: Well, see, well his name was James, because see my uncle – my aunt Ethel, my mom's sister, was married to George Woods.
KNOX: Yeah.
CORKILL: So I have kind of kept up with that outfit. Okay, so he gave a set of keys…
KNOX: A pocket knife. [Long pause] I checked- Pearlie, my brother- I mean, my brother worked for him for quite a bit, levelling ground and all of that, so I checked with him. I said, "did he ever tell you that?" He says, "Oh yeah."
CORKILL: Well, see, that [laughs] that set of keys would be wonderful if he didn't know what they went to, you know! I mean, you talk about using your head, huh?
KNOX: [Laughing]
CORKILL: Well see… When this old Lem Allen came here too, the original Lem, he tells about coming across that bridge and they wanted, I think, two dollars and 50 cents, and he didn't have that much money, so he had a big to do with the bridge keeper, and I think he finally thumped him with his whip or something and went on through, but they did have their moment there. And then I think at one time there was a lady that owned that. Maybe it was Mrs.- She was Mrs. Redman, maybe there was a Mrs. Redman?
KNOX: First… First I knew was [William and Maria] Hills
CORKILL: Okay.
KNOX: It was Hill and Grimes at one time, and then Grimes bought Hill out. And they had a post office there. It was the Hill post office. I had the pigeonhole that come out of that in Sparks, but… Miss Nichols' son in law come and married Jean [?] I blew- I had hopes to make a… [?]
CORKILL: Oh yeah?
KNOX: He tore that all down. I wanted to save it, take it away, but he tore it down, took it to Sierra Valley.
CORKILL: Oh, now see that's that Wayne Hayes, right? That now lives down in…
KNOX: Yeah.
CORKILL: Southern Nevada, and he writes stories every once in a while about the Wild and going West? Well then, do you know anything about this man they call him Billy Hill? Was his name Bill Hill?
KNOX: I don't really know. All I know is Hill and Grimes. I was telling the bookcase- What Hayes uses the bookcase down there. I have it, I use it as a dish cupboard.
CORKILL: Oh yeah?
KNOX: I'm not giving it to Jean Hayes!
CORKILL: Yeah?
KNOX: Her dad or grandfather owned the Grimes ranch.
CORKILL: She she's… had real bad health. She had a heart attack or something this year didn't she?
KNOX: Yeah.
CORKILL: Poor old thing…
KNOX: Double, triple bypass, I think.
CORKILL: Lovely lady. I really never knew her much until Sonia Sanford may have hired Goef, and that's my neighbor [?]. She and Jean, I guess they knew each other actually when they- the Sanfords lived up in Sparks too?
KNOX: Uh-huh. They went to school together.
CORKILL: Went to school together. And that's how I got to know Jean. [Long pause] Okay, now let's see, what, um… And then they irrigated this alfalfa through the ditches of the Bureau of Reclamation, or was it still on the river?
KNOX: No, they began- they irrigated out of the dam, then. Mr. Grimes would never sign up. That's out of a little reservoir he had in there. He made these reservoirs as long as water was coming down the Carson River, why, he could irrigate just like Ben Smart, that never signed for it. So he, Mr. Grimes made these reservoirs over there. He'd tell us [?] that he… he had a little alfalfa field there by the old house, and he'd irrigate that. [inaudible] Diagonal train in, I made us a flume across so we could get water.
CORKILL: We have some pictures here of the early days of just the hills, you know the sand hills and stuff, and people were so grateful to receive water that they didn't care if it was on their property line or how, just so they could get their water. Well, nowadays that the land is getting more valuable, just like where we live. Our property line goes through the living room of some people that moved a house in north of us on where that Orville Fowler [?] used to live for a long time. There was that cemetery. And the day will come where there's just going to be terrible wars because the ditches just went wherever it was… the ground was low and it was easy to put them in, you know? But that water did save the valley and now I guess it's gonna go away. It's gonna end up in Reno, probably.
KNOX: They're gonna direct the country.
CORKILL: Yeah… Well, then how many years did you live down there?
KNOX: 24.
CORKILL: Now this Mrs. Cirac that, you know, we all associate you with, was she the mother of Frank Cushman's wife?
KNOX: Yeah.
CORKILL: Annie, the lady's name was Annie Cirac, your friend?
KNOX: Yeah.
CORKILL: And then Stella. Now see, but Stella's still alive somewhere, I think.
KNOX: As far as we know. We don't know where she is. She's only one of the family.
CORKILL: But you don't know where she is, huh? And then, see, then the daughter, Nadine, I have never- None of us have ever seen her, I guess. She came here once, oh, maybe 30 years ago down here to Hillyard's drugstore and needed some medicine, and she said she didn't have any money but to charge to my dad, and they called out the ranch and he said oh yeah, you know, he didn't care, and no one's ever seen her. I have no idea.
KNOX: Oh, they were living together in Auburn when Irene was… got awful sick because of all that. She said they couldn't be bothered, they were heading for Tennessee.
CORKILL: Oh my gosh!
KNOX: That's the last we've heard.
CORKILL: Now, this is Irene Fryberg that just passed away last year?
KNOX: Yeah.
CORKILL: And so then they were off… so she's still just touring around?
KNOX: As far as I know. She had a daughter went down there, so they went to her. They wanted to…
CORKILL: Oh, from another different marriage later on?
KNOX: Yeah.
CORKILL: You mean, yeah, older than Nadine- I mean, younger than Nadine. Somebody else.
KNOX: Well, I mean Nadine's daughter.
CORKILL: Oh, I see! Oh, I see.
KNOX: Because Stella only had the one daughter.
CORKILL: Oh, okay. Because that… you know, life is so crazy, and I start trying to find my- work on my family history here just a few years ago. I was very intelligent, I waited until everybody had passed on, you know, that's the first thing you need to do. [laughs] So then I did get the address of a Pat. Now, see, Frank had a wife named Mildred and they had Pat and Pat is a few months younger than I am, so she would be the very last one in our family. And she lives up in Boise, Idaho.
KNOX: Oh?
CORKILL: And she sent me pictures of her children. She has beautiful children and she's a beautiful girl too. And then, let's see, her mother, I think, lives over around Oroville, California.
KNOX: Well, that's where she was from.
CORKILL: Uh-huh, Mildred. And then, of course, poor Frances Cushman, you know, you talk about being under… born under a bad sign. Everything that… bad that could happen happened to Frances. She just had such terrible… such a terrible life. But she's passed on, and so there aren't very many of us left anymore. [Long pause] Okay, so now when- Now, you left down here after the Navy bought that property?
KNOX: Oh yeah, uh-huh.
CORKILL: Is that what- that's the reason you left? Or did you-
KNOX: Well, no, they sold the place.
CORKILL: Oh, they sold to May?
KNOX: Oh, they sold it to…
CORKILL: That's okay, it's not important.
KNOX: He was out from Scheckler district. He and his father.
CORKILL: Oh that- It doesn't matter. To somebody else, and then he…
KNOX: He sold it again.
CORKILL: And then…
KNOX: That's what makes me mad. Now everyone knows that as the May ranch. They don't-
CORKILL: Listen, my mother is- gets hysterical about that. Not only is she angry when people say the May Ranch, she says, "That no-good so and so, all he ever did was sell some encyclopedias in Los Angeles and made some money and came up here and- and that is the Grimes Ranch and that is the Grimes Ranch and don't you ever call it anything else!"
KNOX: It's old-timers pretty near all call it the May Ranch! And it's funny, you keep-
CORKILL: And that fellow, he didn't really own it very many years.
KNOX: No.
CORKILL: You know, maybe, I don't even know if five years, actually.
KNOX: Yeah, I'd guess probably…
CORKILL: Something.
KNOX: Funny I kept up this whole thing.
CORKILL: Oh, it'll come to you after. Don't worry about it [ed- Notes say it was owned by Humphrey Supply company, then sold to Mark Hayden, who then sold it to May]. The harder you think about things like that the worse it gets. And then May sold to the Navy. And I well remember when they shut that gate, but I can't tell you the date. I don't know whether it was in the fifties when they closed that road or not.
KNOX: I never tried to get in since then. I probably could have, but I never tried to go back. [laughs]
CORKILL: Yeah. So then after you left here, you moved to Sparks. And did you live on the Nichols place up there?
KNOX: Yeah. Up until I got married. [To Katheryn]
CORKILL: Do you remember when Mrs. Cirac passed away?
KNOX: No, I don't. You see, she went to Irene's and then she got worse, and see, and they took her down to Sacramento and I don't quite remember the date. But she was up in her eighties.
CORKILL: Uh-huh. And then when did you get married up there?
KNOX: 19… [Laughs] Let's see, I was 60… I'll figure it out.
CORKILL: Oh, Okay. And then I'm very sorry, you just lost your wife. I never had the privilege of meeting her, but…
KNOX: Yeah she was… After she found out you were on this genealogy, see she was working on mine.
CORKILL: Oh, uh-huh.
KNOX: She was gonna try to get in touch with you. Someone said you go to Salt Lake [City] once in a while.
CORKILL: Once in a while I have, yeah.
KNOX: She was gonna try to get in touch with you, but she never got that far at all.
CORKILL: Oh, well did she have some of it done? I mean-
KNOX: Yeah, she got along pretty well, but pretty sure her daughter took her there.
CORKILL: Oh, I see. Oh with her, uh-huh.
KNOX: She works hard.
CORKILL: Yeah.
KNOX: She and I are on hours and hours [?] I don't know if we'll ever finish it or not.
CORKILL: That's too bad. Well, it's too bad you don't have a copy because those… I realize that your wife was LDS [Latter-day Saints, or Mormon] and they really do believe in that, but they just let everybody use their facility, and they're just… beg people to come. Like down here at the new church is where our library… you know, our library is in Fallon. And they just really ask people to come and use it because if you don't then the elders or whatever are gonna close it, you know, they can't- I mean, it costs a lot to keep their liberal going and if people don't use it, then they're gonna close it. So I haven't been there for a while, but I do indeed go. And like I say, I've done the Cushmans back to the 1600s.
KNOX: Wow…
CORKILL: But I just didn't- Well, I was real lucky because my dad's family, they came on the Mayflower, which I didn't realize. Now see, one of my dad- Dad had two half-brothers: Royal, who married Ada Kaiser, I don't know if you ever met him.
KNOX: Well, I had heard of them, yeah.
CORKILL: And then a Clement, the second brother.
KNOX: Frank used to tell me about it. He didn't know much about it either, I don't think.
CORKILL: Uh-huh. Well, see and then this Royal, apparently he did the family history way back until forever and ever, and I suppose that he had all the pictures and everything that's important.
KNOX: Oh.
CORKILL: And then they moved over to St. Helena, California and after he died, I guess Ada burned all that stuff up.
KNOX: Wow.
CORKILL: And it just breaks my heart! But anyway, as I say, because of the Pilgrim connection, the first three generations from 1620 this way were already done, so I just had to go back and I was able to do that.
KNOX: That lady got real interested. Of course, her folks, hers and all that was done.
CORKILL: Oh, huh.
KNOX: So she started in on mine. [Laughing] I didn't give her much cooperation! I said I don't want to help.
CORKILL: You really didn't? Now, just out of curiosity, you didn't wanna know?
KNOX: Oh, no. I… I just couldn't tell her that. Well then she got started and then I was interested in it. Called our lady [loud scraping noise covering sound] and everything. She just cut [?] something the other day one that. Just happened to notice this morning.
CORKILL: Well, that might be just something wonderful, you know! Did you open it like a certificate?
KNOX: I haven't no. Still have a… as a matter of fact. Happened to Iah [?], so it was… I think just telling them they were right [?]
CORKILL: Oh, well it might even be a certificate of some kind
KNOX: Maybe I'll look at it.
CORKILL: Yeah, okay. Well, let's stop this puppy… [End of tape]
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